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	Thu, 07 Jan 2016 05:08:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject:	Re: [geda-user] (SQL file open/save)
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From:	"Sabin Iacob (iacobs AT m0n5t3r DOT info) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" <geda-user AT delorie DOT com>
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On 01/07/2016 01:54 PM, Levente (leventelist AT gmail DOT com) [via
geda-user AT delorie DOT com] wrote:
> Okay.
>
>
> I agree that first the data model shall be defined.


some of it is already defined, right? it's a matter of cleaning up
existing concepts and adding what's missing... talking with zero
knowledge of the internals here, so don't take my word for it.


> So you say we shall roll our own file format?


"we" already have an "own" file format, there's nothing wrong with
tailoring your data storage to your own needs; I, for one, would like to
see at least named fields (syntax) and a coordinate system that makes
sense (data model)


>
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 7:47 AM, Sabin Iacob (iacobs AT m0n5t3r DOT info
> <mailto:iacobs AT m0n5t3r DOT info>) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com
> <mailto:geda-user AT delorie DOT com>] <geda-user AT delorie DOT com
> <mailto:geda-user AT delorie DOT com>> wrote:
>
>     On 01/06/2016 09:28 PM, Nicklas Karlsson
>     (nicklas DOT karlsson17 AT gmail DOT com <mailto:nicklas DOT karlsson17 AT gmail DOT com>=
)
>     [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com <mailto:geda-user AT delorie DOT com>] wrote:
>     >> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016 18:09:12 +0100
>     >> "Nicklas Karlsson (nicklas DOT karlsson17 AT gmail DOT com
>     <mailto:nicklas DOT karlsson17 AT gmail DOT com>) [via
>     >> geda-user AT delorie DOT com <mailto:geda-user AT delorie DOT com>]"
>     <geda-user AT delorie DOT com <mailto:geda-user AT delorie DOT com>> wrote:
>     >>
>     >>> Then it come to SQL can you solve file open and save as usual?
>     Or do
>     >>> you have to make connection to some kind of database?
>     >> Yes. SQLite.
>     >>
>     >> https://www.sqlite.org/
>     >>
>     >> Using server/client architectured database engin like
>     postgresql is IMHO
>     >> overkill.
>     >>
>     >> Lev
>     > I used SQL once to write a small database application but I used
>     an SQL server and even though it works and could be done it will
>     be rather complicated for ordinary use. With a simple library
>     binding it could be worth a try.
>     >
>     >
>
>     all right, can't stand it any more, I've been eating my words for a=

>     while now: please, please, please, stop with this SQL nonsense...
>     I know
>     that once you find a new shiny hammer everything looks like a
>     nail, but
>     schematics and PCBs are graphs at the core, and SQL databases are a=

>     pretty bad fit for storing graphs (yes, you can shoehorn them in - =
see
>     mptt - but the results are more often than not awful); I too would
>     like
>     to see a more comprehensible file format for PCB, but SQL will be
>     anything but comprehensible (source: used SQL extensively for the l=
ast
>     15 or so years as a developer and a server babysitter).
>
>     as far as file formats go, while something standard like json or
>     (cringe) yaml or (cringe even harder) xml would have advantages
>     (ubiquitous library support, easy-ish to parse and modify with awk =
&
>     friends for people who are so inclined), it will degenerate into
>     unproductive holy wars (see previous pushes for lua as the file
>     format,
>     or various bickering about which text format is best); the way I
>     see it,
>     the process looks like this:
>
>     * decide on data model; this is where you think hard about what
>     you need
>     to do, how it maps to the physical world, etc.
>     * decide on syntax, write formal grammar; this is where you take in=
to
>     account parse-ability with standard text tools and human brains
>     (I, for
>     one, am a big fan of "design for humans first, computers later")
>     * have a parser generator generate parsers for every language you u=
se,
>     generate some more as they are requested
>
>     problem solved, you get canonical parsers for all languages that ar=
e
>     needed and no extra layers of FFI (which can be needlessly heavy)
>
>



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