Message-ID:	<32701803.6476@gbrmpa.gov.au>
Date:	Fri, 25 Oct 1996 09:29:40 +0800
From:	Leath Muller <leathm AT gbrmpa DOT gov DOT au>
Reply-To:	leathm AT gbrmpa DOT gov DOT au
Organization:	Great Barrier Reef Marine Park Authority
MIME-Version:	1.0
To:	Graham Howard Wile <an118 AT chebucto DOT ns DOT ca>
CC:	djgpp AT delorie DOT com
Subject:	Re: NEEDED: Advice on tools for games programming
References:	<54mc7t$22o AT News DOT Dal DOT Ca>

>        Hi there. I have recently bought books on programming games in
> C++ with a little bit of inline assembly mixed in.
...
>         I have the DJGPP C++ compiler whose documentation is cryptic at
> best, and it uses AT&T assembly for syntax, and all I can find for books on
> assembly are for the Intel style syntax.

Who needs books? You have all these people sitting right here in this
news group/mailer who can help you much better than a book can... :)
Beside, there should be a book out for DJGPP soon... heh heh...

There is also some excellent tutorials on the web about AT&T style asm
programming... so you should grab those, and if there something you
don't understand, I am sure someone here will be able to help you!
(Within a day too usually! Thats better than commercial companies... ;)

>         QUESTIONS:
> 
>         Since I am just introducing myself to low-level programming, (I
> even have yet to learn C++ and Assembly), would it be wise to invest my
> $$ in a commercial, well documented compiler like Turbo C++, Watcom, or
> MS Visual C++ ?

I have Borland C++ 4.5 - and it told me absolutely nothing. Now that I
am more experienced (after learning DJGPP) I know that you pay an awful
lot of money for an awful crappy compiler. I have also mucked around in
MS VC++ 2.0 - and its not much better... However, if your going to do
Windows programming, both of these have a nice editor for designing
you windows etc for your program. OTOH (getting long now... ;) these
two compilers both rely _heavily_ on C++ - if you dont know C, then 
this makes it even harder...
 
>         Do these commercial versions come with good books, including how to
> implement inline assembly?

Borland dit say squat about it...and what it did, sucked... :)
 
>         Should I buy their assembler along with the C++ compiler ?

Turbo Assembly from Borland cost me $200...it was actually a decent
assembler...and it had a dooby little book full of all the intel 
assembler instructions, and how long each takes to execute on each of
the processors etc etc. But its not mixable with DJGPP...
 
>         Is C++ with inline assembly even the way to go nowadays for games
> development, or is this fundamental method on its way out, about to be
> replaced by something better ? Because I don't want to spend my
> hard-earned $$ on this stuff if it will soon be obselete.

If your developing for DOS, you _CAN'T_ go past DJGPP. It is _so_ much
better than all the other compilers - and its free. If your going for
Windows, then I can't help you much...they're all pretty much the same
and it comes down to personal preference as to which one you use...
As for C++, and this is my humble opinion, it isn't satisfactory for
games...it makes HUGE executables that generally run slow. And for most
stuff you do in games, its probably easier to do in C anyway...

Leathal.

- Raw text -