X-Authentication-Warning: delorie.com: mail set sender to geda-user-bounces using -f X-Recipient: geda-user AT delorie DOT com DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=dxvTbI0xte0GIX8l6oo/lmzdEBKpAZXR5/mndpsjhPE=; b=FXakmfCJx4BBQ7wweT+ZvBXo1KBHWWm8L0727qfeBAlCaGwg0Ti/7RYX3SYwahOPcu 5G2OHfxu4ZpCssAxT3W08gDjTQNrj9XeqjMVW9zyfD78AO5KmFa/0TY75YI/0pKIO6Jj HWoVA6+7xBvf3sS0yjK/ImKmV/7SKFYhEVf3c5PRZQhueD3nWNh+vGoYRrhgVlH0P0oq VxSlZSumbVz3zhu1QF6LQH0D/o1I/7xTqol4Q+heMifGyS06pcTaaCJScq/RmFndxeoj dmWda5ThKNiA8+v2PbOxgEi3pvErF//xTnPxOv9uxakcLoT6fUEpnaqR0kJejkwL59N2 C4UA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.182.204.41 with SMTP id kv9mr1191318obc.78.1394555043656; Tue, 11 Mar 2014 09:24:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20140311130801.94D928020170@turkos.aspodata.se> References: <20140127234944 DOT 924148045B78 AT turkos DOT aspodata DOT se> <20140128201110 DOT DF7D78045B78 AT turkos DOT aspodata DOT se> <20140129072550 DOT GA24560 AT localhost DOT localdomain> <86CABBE6-EE80-4347-B7AA-3F5A8DA4C658 AT noqsi DOT com> <1394402434 DOT 2151 DOT 28 DOT camel AT AMD64X2 DOT fritz DOT box> <20140311130801 DOT 94D928020170 AT turkos DOT aspodata DOT se> Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2014 20:24:03 +0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [geda-user] identical symbol names From: =?KOI8-R?B?4czFy9PFyiDowdLYy8/X08vJyg==?= To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8ff1c01cff3a7504f4572579 Reply-To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Errors-To: nobody AT delorie DOT com X-Mailing-List: geda-user AT delorie DOT com X-Unsubscribes-To: listserv AT delorie DOT com Precedence: bulk --e89a8ff1c01cff3a7504f4572579 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Assume you have a symbol which was included in many your schemas from > CVS. > > Example capacitor or other usable for you. > > Througth time autor change pin length and make this less. > > All schemas in you archive is broken. > > You can solve this example noting the version you used and include it > somewhere so people can exstract the same version from cvs. A checksum > could be provided as an extra check. > What solve? Symbol already changed. Checksum wrong. Yes. What gschem must do? Message report? Or CVS roll back? Or contact autor? > > 2. When there exist different sources with the same name. For this case > > > you can insert more data into the symbol, i.e. authors name and version > > > number. > > > > > That is, all versions must be kept, even when they are outdated.... > > That is, project developers must have a centralized repository of > > characters. > > You don't need a "centralized" repository, you need some kind of > version control, and it is a good investment to use one. All developers in his computers should have identical symbols (copies) and version control, even if not editing, simple view. For this they need to use many third-party tools for to ensure reliability his work, instead simple use of Schematic editor. Not all engineers want it. Many want to be sure that they can always open and see his scheme, which they did years ago, when they need it, istead to make body movements with version control program and others to eliminate unexpected bugs. It is certainly possible to embed all symbols in his scheme, but why keep the scheme in many of the same characters, if you can keep one as I propose to do. I do not really understand why we need these EMBEDDED characters in the form in which they exist. They only complicate the syntax of sch-file and complicate scripts writing. EMBEDDED [ ] and etc. Check if you have a disk related problem, are your file currupt, > contact the author of the symbol, etc. > And the author will respond to you through a month. Surely... :) A checksum is a check that "all are in order". The procedure to handle > any mismatch is not solved by using a checksum, but it helps to _detect_ > possible problems. > That's understandable. Followed by curses and body movements. So your case for the "in the file library" solution is: > > 1, solve same name problem > 2, get some reliability against sym file changes > And make this without manual activity. 3, and distribution > Am I right? > Yes. 1 and 2 could be solved by including author/vendor and version > information. > Not solve. Only detect. 3 can be solved by making the your repo. public or by having some > "collect and distribute" script. > Yes. It may be. But all this is more difficult then 30-50 rows of C code for change libgeda. Also minus is that all these solutions are distributed. There are thousands of scripts to make any changes to the schema file. Only refdesrenum-like scripts are about 10, maybe 100. But there is no one place where collected their descriptions. Although this is the main function of the program and shold be performed with gschem. User, especially the new user, confused and repelled by this approach. And yes, implementing thoose things, so your solution have a head > start, but others can catch up. The most interesting thing right now > is to identify problem areas of gschem sym file handling, proposing > different solutions, and sharing experiences. Implementation comes > later. You have a solution and an implementation, and that is a > very good starting point when trying to nail down a problem and > for discussions. > I agree completely. --e89a8ff1c01cff3a7504f4572579 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

=
> Assume you have a symbol which was included in many your schemas from = CVS.
> Example capacitor or other usable for you.
> Througth time autor change pin length and make this less.
> All schemas in you archive is broken.

You can solve this example noting the version you used and include it=
somewhere so people can exstract the same version from cvs. A checksum
could be provided as an extra check.
What solve?
Symbol already changed.
Checksum wrong. Yes.
What gschem must do? Message report? Or CVS roll back? Or contact au= tor?

> > 2. When there exist different sources with the same name. For thi= s case
> > you can insert more data into the symbol, i.e. authors name and v= ersion
> > number.
> >
> That is, all versions must be kept, even when they are outdated.... > That is, project developers must have a centralized repository of
> characters.

You don't need a "centralized" repository, you need som= e kind of
version control, and it is a good investment to use one.=A0
All developers in his computers should have identical symbols (copies) an= d version control, even if not editing, simple view.

For = this they need to use=A0 many third-party tools for to ensure reliability his work,= instead simple use of Schematic editor.
Not all engineers want it.

Many want to be sure that they can always open and se= e his scheme, which they did years ago, when they need it, istead to make= = body movements with= version control program and others to eliminate unexpected bugs.

It is c= ertainly possible to embed = all symbols in his scheme, but = why keep the scheme in many of the sa= me characters, if you can keep = one as I propose to do.<= /span>
I do not really understand why we need these EMBEDDED characters in the form in which they exist.
They only complicate the syntax
of sch-file and compli= cate scripts writing. EMBEDDED [ ] and etc.
=

Check if you have a disk related problem, are your file currupt,
contact the author of the symbol, etc.
=A0And the author <= span class=3D"">will respond to you=A0through a month. Surely... :)

A checksum is a check that "all are in order". The procedure to h= andle
any mismatch is not solved by using a checksum, but it helps to _detect_ possible problems.
That's understa= ndable.
Followed by curses and body movements.

So your case for the "in the file library" solution is:

1, solve same name problem
2, get some reliability against sym file changes
And make this without manual activity.

3, and distribution=
Am I right?
Yes.

1 and 2 could be solved by including author/vendor and version
information.
Not solve. Only detect.

3 can be solved by making the your repo. public or by having some
"collect and distribute" script.
Yes. It may= be.

But all this is more difficult then 30-50 rows of C= code for change libgeda.

Also minus is that all these solutions are distributed.
There are thousands of scripts to<= /span> make any changes to the schema file.
Only refdesrenum-like scripts are about 10, maybe
100.<= /span>
But there is no one place where col= lected their descriptions.<= /span>

Although this is the = main function of the progra= m and shold be performed with gschem.

User,= especially the new user, <= span class=3D"">confused
and repelled by this approach.


And yes, implementing thoose things, so your solution have a head
start, but others can catch up. The most interesting thing right now
is to identify problem areas of gschem sym file handling, proposing
different solutions, and sharing experiences. Implementation comes
later. You have a solution and an implementation, and that is a
very good starting point when trying to nail down a problem and
for discussions.
I agree completely.
<= br>
--e89a8ff1c01cff3a7504f4572579--